| [15:06]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
Yes, Geneko is correct -- HUDs and Big Spaceship
|
| [15:06]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
yumyum spam ^^
|
| [15:06]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
will ben be stopping by?
|
| [15:06]
|
Crane Zenovka:
|
Hi Benjamin
|
| [15:06]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
aha, speak of the devil :)
|
| [15:06]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
speak of the devil....
|
| [15:06]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
Hellos Benjamin!
|
| [15:06]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
ahoy ben! *waves*
|
| [15:07]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Ahoy Ben!
|
| [15:07]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
(jinx on malbers)
|
| [15:07]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
People seems to like to poke fun on their full-Flash website.
|
| [15:07]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
oh now I'm the devil
|
| [15:07]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
you have been promoted? ;)
|
| [15:07]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
lol
|
| [15:07]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
large blue staticy devil
|
| [15:07]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
hi all
|
| [15:07]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
Hellos ^^
|
| [15:07]
|
Crane Zenovka:
|
lol =)
|
| [15:07]
|
Charlette Proto:
|
hi Ben I'll be Avatar just for today
|
| [15:07]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
sorry I'm late
|
| [15:07]
|
Theodore Folsom:
|
whoops ... Hullows @ll
|
| [15:07]
|
Theo says:
|
Get your Squirrelly Hand off my nosey.
|
| [15:07]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
but it wouldn't be me if I wasn't!
|
| [15:07]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
:-)
|
| [15:08]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
I know that I'm really a n00b when it comes to HUDs
|
| [15:08]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
I don't really use any
|
| [15:08]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
You are not late. You are just in time ^^
|
| [15:08]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
My poinion that more people need to come here still holds.
|
| [15:08]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
need to pick up a mystitool malbers
|
| [15:08]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
what kinds of functionality are best suited for HUDs?
|
| [15:08]
|
Male Equine - Tail: Theodore Folsom Get your hand off my tail or you will make it dirty!
|
| [15:09]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
usually information displays, avatar controls and the like
|
| [15:09]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
what does the mystitool do?
|
| [15:09]
|
McCabe Maxsted uses his hud for radar
|
| [15:09]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
I hate the way huds have such inconsistent interfaces and visual presentation
|
| [15:09]
|
Geneko Nemeth does not use HUDs.
|
| [15:09]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
I've had HUDs for av control -- usually special effects
|
| [15:09]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
radar most common, though that would be nicer in the client
|
| [15:09]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
They take up screen space and hard to move.
|
| [15:09]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
hugs kisses etc
|
| [15:09]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
Mystitool: http://www.xstreetsl.com/modules.php?name=Marketplace&file=item&ItemID=120285
|
| [15:09]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
radar for combat systems?
|
| [15:09]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
most huds I've seen do radar or combat controls
|
| [15:10]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
no, just for detecting nearby avs
|
| [15:10]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
who's in chat range, etc
|
| [15:10]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Detecting griefers...
|
| [15:10]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
would be nice to see HUDs get used more for augmented (virtual) reality
|
| [15:10]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
you're limited to 16 due to llsensor, but it's so handy
|
| [15:10]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
wouldn't recommend anyone use SL™ without some form of radar
|
| [15:10]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
oh, so radar with extra info -- more than the mini-map?
|
| [15:10]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
For example, names.
|
| [15:10]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Some sailboats use a HUD to displaying wind direction, speed, etc., and offer buttons for raising and lowering the sails and so forth
|
| [15:10]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
I have a griefing/combat hug with the biggest screen realestate waste - the Quantom Core
|
| [15:11]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
C:SI does a nice thing when selecting someone to challenge to a dual by placing a box round the avatar in the world view that you can click to select them
|
| [15:11]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Avatar control should go without saying.
|
| [15:11]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
I pass out the crystal gadget radar to noobs; they never know who's in chat distance and who isn't
|
| [15:11]
|
Malbers Linden wants to see Chareltte's combat hug
|
| [15:11]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
I have seen an attempt to create a HUD that would map avatar positions from 3D to 2D, take the camera position and stuff into account to 'draw' boxes around avatars
|
| [15:11]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Whoa, how cute!
|
| [15:11]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
only use it to read the User Support IM chat
|
| [15:11]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Hmm,,, a linden?
|
| [15:11]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
hehe notworth the money otherwise
|
| [15:12]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
And hiding behind a console... >_>
|
| [15:12]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
Squirrel, that's what C:SI does
|
| [15:12]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Interesting
|
| [15:12]
|
Chaley May:
|
I used a hud to make a snapshot to use as a sculptie :)
|
| [15:12]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
How does that work, Chaley?
|
| [15:12]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
any HUDs that would be especially useful for new residents?
|
| [15:13]
|
Chaley May:
|
it didnt work well too blurry
|
| [15:13]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
maybe the radar ones?
|
| [15:13]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
my opinion is that a standard interface for HUD building should be developed
|
| [15:13]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
there used to be one for noobs
|
| [15:13]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
it was badly received
|
| [15:13]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
yes, I heard (back there somewhere) that HUD UIs are too disparate
|
| [15:13]
|
Theodore Folsom:
|
there was that new users guide once for newbies ... was available on the OIs .... was helpful imho
|
| [15:13]
|
Theodore Folsom:
|
was a HUD*
|
| [15:13]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Yeah, helpful when it worked...
|
| [15:13]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Gesture controls that intergrate with the client, oh that would be sweet~
|
| [15:13]
|
McCabe Maxsted nods. I'd throw a radar one in by default
|
| [15:14]
|
Chaley May:
|
i like making HUDs
|
| [15:14]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
but I think a noob HUD is a better way to learn than any notecard system would
|
| [15:14]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Yeah, I was pretty confused by that Orientation HUD too (among other problems like lag connection across the pacific).
|
| [15:14]
|
Theodore Folsom:
|
agreed Avatar
|
| [15:14]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
hud interfaces would be so much nicer if we had that text-prim idea that was brought up a while back ;)
|
| [15:14]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
radar and a few poses, maybe basic AO
|
| [15:14]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
I have my AO as a HUD. It has buttons for turning on and off, for using a sit pose, etc. Based on ZHAO-II
|
| [15:15]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
HUDs that use a mysql database in the background could be used to provide information for players... like, cool places to visit and such
|
| [15:15]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
above att access to help notes
|
| [15:15]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
These, though, really should be built into the viewer by default.
|
| [15:15]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
SQL backend would be great - up to date
|
| [15:15]
|
McCabe Maxsted would rather see aos become built into the client, but yeah, that's another *really* common. AOs are a right of passage in SL™ culture
|
| [15:15]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Another interesting HUD is the FilterCam. It puts image overlays on your screen for special effects when taking pictures. There's one that's white with a picture of an iPhone, but the iPhone screen is transparent so you can see the scene through it, hehe
|
| [15:15]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
"you have stepped up from a noob! here's a new walk"
|
| [15:16]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
but a HUD is a way to keep it in one place and detach when no longer used
|
| [15:16]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
so I've heard the notion of a "tourguide" HUD for new residents, yes?
|
| [15:16]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
that sounds like a gimmick
|
| [15:16]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Yep, Malbers
|
| [15:16]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
I may have such a "tourguide" hud
|
| [15:17]
|
McCabe Maxsted nods
|
| [15:17]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
that is what I was remembering (main account)
|
| [15:17]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
basically its a pda-style image viewer
|
| [15:17]
|
Theodore Folsom:
|
i found it
|
| [15:17]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
is that better as a HUD or just built into the Viewer in other ways?
|
| [15:17]
|
Theodore Folsom:
|
i have one
|
| [15:17]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
thing with tour type things is that they need to be actively kept up to date
|
| [15:17]
|
Theodore Folsom:
|
who needs?
|
| [15:17]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
for noobs I think a video would be the best way to introduce SL like games do
|
| [15:17]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
It's best if HUDs can run on the Viewer, makes things faster.
|
| [15:17]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
they easily get out of date
|
| [15:18]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
know the video is a problem
|
| [15:18]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
you mean like a video intro?
|
| [15:18]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
yes like all the games
|
| [15:18]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Not all the games...
|
| [15:18]
|
Chaley May:
|
would be more fun if the tour guide was a well made robot they could follow in world
|
| [15:18]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
this is what it is this is what you are this is what you do
|
| [15:18]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Navi? Is that you?
|
| [15:18]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
interesting idea. Good excuse to put a guitar solo into the viewer XD
|
| [15:18]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
hehe
|
| [15:18]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
heh, virtual tourguide rendered as an avatar only they can see
|
| [15:19]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
invisible friend lol
|
| [15:19]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
hah
|
| [15:19]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Although I wouldn't say no to the Navi idea.
|
| [15:19]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
my own mentor to torture
|
| [15:19]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Invisible friend FTW~
|
| [15:19]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
SL Mental Griefer
|
| [15:19]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Being able to contact a mentor through the Navi. Would also be an interesting idea.
|
| [15:19]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Ohmygosh. It grew big.
|
| [15:20]
|
Malbers Linden sees that Squirrel is using his vast knowledge of SL to rez things sneakily
|
| [15:20]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
haha. Noobhelper Linden says "I see that you've logged into SL. Would you like to create a spreadsheet?"
|
| [15:20]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
hahahaha
|
| [15:20]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
:D
|
| [15:20]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Nothing says that you can rez stuff on another parcel and drag it in the client strings... >_<
|
| [15:21]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
you could have different ones for different entry channels
|
| [15:21]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
are there HUDs that are well tuned for Builders?
|
| [15:21]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Or let people make their own.
|
| [15:21]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
I had a parrot freestandin here last week, great pictures
|
| [15:21]
|
Squirrel Wood points out that this is a hud that only uses a few key control elements
|
| [15:21]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
"FightClub Linden breaks your legs and says "NOW learn to walk""
|
| [15:21]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
we need menus for HUDs like the rest of the viewer
|
| [15:22]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
instead of dialogs
|
| [15:22]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
I think there are HUDs for builders that let you rez differently shaped prims
|
| [15:22]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
I've heard of a good builder tool in a HUD, Prim.Docker?
|
| [15:22]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Or something like that.
|
| [15:22]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
yeah, a lot of people use Prim.Docker for building
|
| [15:22]
|
McCabe Maxsted nods. I've used that from time to time, it's not bad
|
| [15:22]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
It has a lot of texture and prim alignment options. But it requires you to put a script in every prim you're building with
|
| [15:22]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
I generally find it quicker to just do things by numbers
|
| [15:23]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
than keep dropping scripts around
|
| [15:23]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
that is bad news if it requires scripts, unless it wipes them
|
| [15:23]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Also, there's a HUD that will rez megaprims for you at your current location, since they can be hard to place.
|
| [15:23]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
it does wipe them
|
| [15:23]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
I'd really like to see stuff like tutorials put into huds rather than built into the viewer, as they could show wrong information when people travel around the open grid
|
| [15:24]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
good that is essential (too many scripts running already)
|
| [15:24]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
yup the megaprim searching HUD "Salt is handy
|
| [15:24]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
what do you mean McCabe?
|
| [15:24]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
ooh have you used the salt hud? it searches a database of all the megaprims made
|
| [15:24]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
McCabe is right
|
| [15:24]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
gives you the closest sizes it can find to what you ask for
|
| [15:24]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
well, if you have NUE stuff built into a viewer, and someone's logging into say litesim, it'll be inaccurate
|
| [15:24]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
it should stand out from the interface and be optional
|
| [15:25]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
get new different HUDs inworld
|
| [15:25]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
That's why we have [APP_NAME] all over in the SL client.
|
| [15:25]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Unfortunately there still are a lot of strings that involves SL or Lindens...
|
| [15:26]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
well, there's already been a "balkanization" of viewers; all the new grids that are starting to pop up are releasing their own viewers
|
| [15:26]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
so you're saying use huds so they can be customized for the particular server they're on?
|
| [15:26]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
That's it, Ben
|
| [15:26]
|
McCabe Maxsted nods. That'd be nice
|
| [15:26]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
It does make more sense: normally people won't think that "I want to connect to Second Life" yet,
|
| [15:27]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
instead just "I want to use Second Life[application]".
|
| [15:27]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
HUDs are a very good way to customise the viewer inworld
|
| [15:27]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Although all people going to alt grids know the distinction well already.
|
| [15:27]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
Aye.
|
| [15:27]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
the Cool viewer lets you select the grid
|
| [15:28]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
HUDs allow for dynamic change that quickly adapts to new stuff whereas the UI itself is somewhat static
|
| [15:28]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
Cool patch I should have said (old interface however)
|
| [15:28]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
how does the server you're on affect tutorial content?
|
| [15:28]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
new people won't know though, especially when the agent domain is up and we can tp around to other grids; you want your viewer to be able to adapt to that
|
| [15:28]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
For example, on GenekoSim there won't be any Lindens,
|
| [15:28]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
hehe
|
| [15:28]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
the tutorial in the current viewer actually references a web site
|
| [15:28]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
which can be easily updated
|
| [15:28]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Instead administrators will be called Kittens.
|
| [15:29]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
and avatars would all be animals
|
| [15:29]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
So there won't be any Governor Linden either, this means "give up to Governor Linden" won't make any sense.
|
| [15:29]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
Give up to Governor Kitten
|
| [15:30]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
Do/Have any of you created a HUD?
|
| [15:30]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
Is it easy?
|
| [15:30]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
it could reference something on the server, that each person's grid could modify
|
| [15:30]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Nope, never.
|
| [15:30]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
yeah, a few times
|
| [15:30]
|
Chaley May:
|
i made incomplete HUDs :)
|
| [15:30]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
I have. It's just a scripted attachment. The difficulty of it depends on the complexity of the functionality
|
| [15:30]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
it's tricksy :) especially whe you own land and "drop" is disabled (always hated that ui bug)
|
| [15:30]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
HUDs have the downside that you have to build them pretty small inworld or they will clog up two and a half screens when you attach them
|
| [15:31]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
It would be nice to be able to go beyond the 2D HUD and be able to provide 3D interfaces projected in-world that only you can see
|
| [15:31]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
just a bunch of scripts and UI graphics
|
| [15:31]
|
Chaley May:
|
i think you can do that with HUDs
|
| [15:31]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
HUDs inworld would have to be attached to avatar, not the best look and not secret
|
| [15:31]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
I've been thinking about something like that for the movement controls aimee; transparent arrows surrounding your avatar instead of wasting screen space on a window
|
| [15:31]
|
Chaley May:
|
make them look more 3D
|
| [15:31]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
private
|
| [15:32]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
all prims look flat when attached to HUD
|
| [15:32]
|
Aimee Trescothick nods, that sort of thing
|
| [15:32]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Field of Vision.
|
| [15:32]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
I like to see my avatar as a person, no arrows
|
| [15:32]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
the prims look flat until you rotate them. though for proper perspective you will have to employ a number of tricks.
|
| [15:32]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
a hugger "hud" for example could show buttons next to each avatar in view
|
| [15:32]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
and that involves icky math
|
| [15:33]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
image is the most important thing to most users
|
| [15:33]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
One of the difficulties of HUDs is that there are no standard widgets or UI controls. No text fields or scroll bars. Only prims that you can click on.
|
| [15:33]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
yes the math would be ugly
|
| [15:33]
|
Chaley May:
|
im not sure if light sorces affect HUDs at all too so surfaces look the same color
|
| [15:33]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
and dependant on the camera position
|
| [15:33]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
one problem: huds remember screen resolution, but don't adjust position when resultion changes. so if somenoe builds a hud on a widescreen monitor, it won't show up on your regular monitor since it's being drawn off screen
|
| [15:33]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
2D HUDs are the norm
|
| [15:33]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Also it would be hard to make text that align to screen pixels.
|
| [15:33]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
So, the HUD-building tools are nonexistant and the lack of a standard set of HUD controls hamper HUD development?
|
| [15:34]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
another problem with huds: floating text size depends on UI scale
|
| [15:34]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
yeah
|
| [15:34]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
HUDs are just script texture and animation files in a prim really
|
| [15:34]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Yes. As well as the built-in limitations of LSL
|
| [15:34]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Give me XUI+client side script HUDs and that would be super!
|
| [15:34]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
the maths for coping with the 3D aspect are in the client, you just need to render them as "local only" prims
|
| [15:34]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
huds really need to be abstracted from attachments
|
| [15:34]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
LSL is the weakest point
|
| [15:35]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
even wearing them is a pain
|
| [15:35]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
because when you change outfits, it changes your huds
|
| [15:35]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
that can be good and a pain at the same time
|
| [15:35]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
On the other hand though building HUDs from Prims does have the advantage thta you can show them to everyone ^^
|
| [15:35]
|
Chaley May:
|
yes its annoting how everything detaches
|
| [15:35]
|
Chaley May:
|
we need to be able to lock attachments
|
| [15:35]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
eg my TinyMatic is with an outfit which is appropriate
|
| [15:35]
|
Chaley May:
|
especially HUDs
|
| [15:36]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
I just put the HUDs I always use in a separate folder and after changing outfits I shift-drag & drop that folder onto me avatar
|
| [15:36]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
locking huds, interesting idea
|
| [15:36]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
... that kinda makes you want to suggest XUI on a prim...
|
| [15:36]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
look above Tiny need diff stuff
|
| [15:36]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
that'd work for avatars that use a custom ao hud...
|
| [15:36]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
adn rely on forced switching
|
| [15:36]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
some outfits need their own HUDs like Neko tails and ears
|
| [15:37]
|
Chaley May:
|
i think its possible to create a fully 3D world entirely on HUDs
|
| [15:37]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
HUDs are also dependent on script performance. If the sim is bogged down, your HUD will react slow, if at all.
|
| [15:37]
|
Chaley May:
|
i mean the HUDs are the world
|
| [15:37]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Not to mention connection delay.
|
| [15:37]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
hah, a second life client HUD
|
| [15:37]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
so not all HUDs are universal (mine are mostly related to outfit) except for navigation and combat HUDs
|
| [15:37]
|
Aimee Trescothick:
|
we like recursion
|
| [15:37]
|
Chaley May:
|
each attachment could be an avatar
|
| [15:38]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
hehe
|
| [15:38]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
huds could be pretty awesome if there were some sort of development kit... and we didn't have to use laggy xyzzy-text...
|
| [15:38]
|
Chaley May:
|
one attachment for environments
|
| [15:38]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
And common animation/effect HUDs...
|
| [15:38]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
xyzzy is ten times less laggy if you compile it to mono ^^
|
| [15:38]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
ugh, that makes me sad
|
| [15:38]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
oh, less
|
| [15:38]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
thought you said more, der
|
| [15:39]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
There are benefts to HUD attachment to avatar?
|
| [15:39]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Uncaught ParseException.
|
| [15:39]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
wonder how long it'll take for people to use mono versions, especially since I think a lot of people get it from freebie boxes and scripts in inv are only LSL..
|
| [15:40]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Sort of. Because it's attached, it can do things in LSL like override animations and move your avatar around
|
| [15:40]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
But if those limitations weren't there in LSL, there would be no reason to have them attached
|
| [15:40]
|
McCabe Maxsted nods
|
| [15:41]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
I think there is nothing wrong with HUDs being attached as it is
|
| [15:41]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Well, it is a bit troublesome that there are a limited number of attachment points for HUDs
|
| [15:41]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
....
|
| [15:41]
|
Theodore Folsom:
|
ack
|
| [15:42]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
that does seem like an artificial limitation
|
| [15:42]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Nice Sound Effect, Squirrel ^^
|
| [15:42]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
But, it does seem a bit big... how large of a screen would this need?
|
| [15:43]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
this one is optimized for a 4:3 display
|
| [15:43]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
that is true but you can edit them into position which could be replaced with more fixed attachment points
|
| [15:43]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
4:3 is dead now
|
| [15:43]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Yeah, but for the floating text to fit in the buttons...
|
| [15:43]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Not dead yet, Avatar
|
| [15:43]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
give it a while
|
| [15:44]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
floating text depends on UI scale/size
|
| [15:44]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
getting there, though
|
| [15:44]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
1.0 or smaller will look ok
|
| [15:44]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Oh, right...
|
| [15:44]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
nearly even if I love my 24" Compaq screen
|
| [15:45]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
the size is a prob now because it is texture based
|
| [15:45]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Could we take the last 15 minutes to talk about Big Spaceship?
|
| [15:45]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Agreed.
|
| [15:45]
|
Hyper-Flute Composer Edition v3 (HUD1-Upper): Playing Score 'Close Encounters Theme... (Transcribed for Hyper-Flute by Gunkeeper Nabob)'
|
| [15:45]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
should be able to make them of UI elements like the build floater
|
| [15:46]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
sure, were folks finished discussing HUDs?
|
| [15:46]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
fine by me
|
| [15:46]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
Malbers, did you get what you needed?
|
| [15:46]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
I think we'll probably still keep it next week...
|
| [15:46]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
Good start. There is always more.
|
| [15:46]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
We could talk for days about HUDs, hehe
|
| [15:46]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
^^
|
| [15:46]
|
McCabe Maxsted grins
|
| [15:46]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Why nobody talked on sl-ux about HUDs?
|
| [15:46]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
't was a pain to script that one behind me :p
|
| [15:46]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
Could continue the talk about HUDs on SL-UX.
|
| [15:47]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
I have six questions I've prepared about Big Spaceship and the project
|
| [15:47]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
The big one is: What will Big Spaceship be working on, specifically? The viewer interface? New user orientation? On the web, in-world?
|
| [15:47]
|
Malbers Linden thinks Jacek comes TOO prepared
|
| [15:47]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
Jacek comes prepared :-)
|
| [15:48]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
would you like Ben to take these one at a time OR wait until you ask all 6 Qs?
|
| [15:49]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Let's do one at a time, I think
|
| [15:49]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
right now Big Spaceship is putting together a set of recommendations related to the new user experience, from the minute the user hits sl.com, through registration, into the client and their first in-world experiences
|
| [15:49]
|
Mm Alder:
|
Based on them being newbies?
|
| [15:49]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Hopefully that doesn't include gratuitous amounts of Flash ^_^ |
|
| [15:49]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
will it help track griefers
|
| [15:49]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Okay. I take it there aren't any specific plans about what they're going to change, then?
|
| [15:49]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
they are doing design explorations and prototypes but not building anything functional in this phase
|
| [15:49]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
or just criminals
|
| [15:49]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
that's correct Jacek
|
| [15:50]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
we're in the very preliminary phases
|
| [15:50]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
"in this phase" meaning no viewer work is planned for now, but what about the future?
|
| [15:50]
|
Mm Alder:
|
What problem are they trying to solve?
|
| [15:50]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Will they be building something functional after the design phase?
|
| [15:50]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Or will LL be doing the building?
|
| [15:50]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Whoa that's a lot of questions.
|
| [15:51]
|
Mm Alder:
|
...and not many answers.
|
| [15:51]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
hehe
|
| [15:51]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
I'm scrolling back
|
| [15:52]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
McCabe, we have done some preliminary thinking about the Viewer UI but detailed design hasn't yet begun
|
| [15:53]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
Mm, at a high level the problem we're trying to solve with Big Spaceship's help is user retention
|
| [15:53]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
or lack thereof :-)
|
| [15:53]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
hehe
|
| [15:53]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
Jacek, implementation details haven't yet been worked out
|
| [15:53]
|
Mm Alder:
|
Have you surveyed users to see why they leave?
|
| [15:53]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
need to be prepared for high churn since about half come here to find dates
|
| [15:54]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Or a game.
|
| [15:54]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
no kidding I practicall live 24/7 in a welcome area
|
| [15:54]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
You can only type so fast, unless you are an AMS agent and need to kill zombies with your typing.
|
| [15:54]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
implementation will likely be handled through a combination of internal and external development resources
|
| [15:54]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Is it even possible to survey leaving users... oh yeah maybe on uninstalling client...
|
| [15:54]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
I hope they are taking suggestions from the community into account
|
| [15:54]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
the gamers don't fing extrinsic rewards, daters don't find partners
|
| [15:55]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
I'm curious about how Big Spaceship was chosen. Am I correct in assuming that LL chose to outsource it because of limited resources (personell) within the Lab? Or to leverage BS's design experience?
|
| [15:55]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
so they both give up
|
| [15:55]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
that's an interesting observation Avatar
|
| [15:55]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
why do you spend so much time in welcome areas?
|
| [15:55]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
I said I live in a welcome area, practically sleep by the PC
|
| [15:55]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
yes we have surveyed users
|
| [15:56]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
Squirrel, we're working on a plan to gather and respond to community feedback during the course of the project
|
| [15:56]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
just look at the logs from Korea1 and you will be surprised
|
| [15:56]
|
Mm Alder:
|
So what did the survey say?
|
| [15:56]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
Jacek, the decision was a combination of both the factors you mentioned
|
| [15:57]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
people don't tell truth in surveys and those that take them are never a representative sample
|
| [15:57]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
Big Spaceship was chosen during a competitive pitch process with several other design agencies
|
| [15:57]
|
Camber Front Door: Gaio Kiranov is at the door.
|
| [15:57]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Great, that answers my next question :)
|
| [15:57]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Kinda makes me curious who are the other candidates.
|
| [15:57]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
read the logs listen for a few days and you get a better opinion
|
| [15:57]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Welcome area eh.
|
| [15:58]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
Avatar, what are you referring to?
|
| [15:58]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
logs from welcome areas?
|
| [15:58]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Is there a timeframe for the project? Or is it too early for that yet?
|
| [15:58]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
what users come here for and the reasons for the hight churn
|
| [15:59]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
Jacek, it's too early to know specific timelines
|
| [15:59]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Okay
|
| [15:59]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
the high churn is inevitable and we should not run LL based on trying to change that
|
| [15:59]
|
Pop Lubitsch:
|
Boo!
|
| [15:59]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
we're nearly at time, Jacek did you have another question we can answer quickly?
|
| [15:59]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
....
|
| [15:59]
|
Mm Alder:
|
Do you even know if the problem is usability?
|
| [15:59]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
My curiosity has been satisfied, thanks :)
|
| [16:00]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
Mm, my sense is that usability one part of a multi-faceted problem
|
| [16:00]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
ok great, thanks for those questions Jacek
|
| [16:00]
|
McCabe Maxsted nods agreement to that
|
| [16:00]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
Yeah, almost all problems we have now are multifaceted with experience design as one facet
|
| [16:00]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
alright folks, I have to run. thanks again for your participation
|
| [16:00]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Okay, seeya.
|
| [16:00]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Thanks for taking the time, Ben. Take care!
|
| [16:00]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
bye Benj
|
| [16:00]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
Yes, thanks for HUD and Big Space ship discussions
|
| [16:00]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
I guess we're reconvening officially again next month?
|
| [16:00]
|
Theodore Folsom:
|
Byes ^^
|
| [16:01]
|
McCabe Maxsted:
|
take care ben :)
|
| [16:01]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
I may try to pop in between now and then
|
| [16:01]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
Have a nice weekend ^^
|
| [16:01]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
just to check on you guys :-)
|
| [16:01]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
Yep, we are now on our once-a-month scehdule
|
| [16:01]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Correct, Ben. But we'll still be having unofficial discussions here each week :D
|
| [16:01]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Cool then. So next week's topic?
|
| [16:01]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
ok cool, thanks Jacek
|
| [16:01]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
I'm sure we'll be communicating in the SL-UX alias.
|
| [16:01]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
so next week is out?
|
| [16:01]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Anyone have an idea on the topic, put it on the Wiki pages and/or in the mailing list!
|
| [16:01]
|
Benjamin Linden:
|
take care everybody!
|
| [16:02]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
pooff
|
| [16:02]
|
Squirrel Wood:
|
name the wiki url ?
|
| [16:02]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
we have something on the wiki already. Looking.....
|
| [16:02]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
I've made a wiki page about the interest group. There's a link to a page for people to add topics -- https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/User_Experience_Interest_Group
|
| [16:02]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
Topics: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/User_Experience_Interest_Group/Topics
|
| [16:02]
|
Avatar Genira:
|
good i was waiting for that, do we have to register?
|
| [16:02]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
oh crap. we already have this: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Resident_Experience
|
| [16:03]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Where do we put the logs though? On Malbers' page on the RXIG page?
|
| [16:03]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
we'll have to make sure we have pointers back-and-forth
|
| [16:03]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
No problem, Malbers
|
| [16:03]
|
Geneko Nemeth:
|
Now where did I put that formatting script to?
|
| [16:03]
|
Jacek Antonelli:
|
I'll post up today's transcript, by the way
|
| [16:04]
|
Malbers Linden:
|
awesome. thanks Jacek
|